Wife of Aspergers looking for support.

[nfclewley]

@nfclewley

You've received some good information and insight from older, experienced forum members. I won't add to it.
I have only one comment for now, and it's been stated differently already. But it's something I believe you should seriously think about:

In general, asking an Aspie how they "feel" about something is not going to produce a meaningful answer, and is very likely to be a source of considerable stress.

The "why" is simple, and you know the words already - but you don't understand them: we literally don't think the same way as you do.

You can force an Aspie to provide fake answers, but you cannot get what you want. Human brains cannot be "rewired".

Maybe Dave would like to come on here and talk to us. A journey of self discovery can be important and despite what you see, you may not be fully understanding what is going on in his mind.

There are many people here who do not have the capacity to engage in live conversation of any sort… Maybe he would like to write and process things slowly like we do. Also, it is a great place to find friends and establish hobbies.

It is inefficient to give you advice to give to Dave, so maybe he would like it here.

EDIT: remember, as you and Dave are learning more about autism to not only look at communication/ support difficulties. There are many positive and strong things that come with an autistic brain, and it is extremely important to notice and support the growth of these things. this is something forum members taught me, which is why I would encourage Dave to be here.

Hi Dave! You are welcome here. Natalie, too! This forum has proven to be a very accepting and understanding bunch of people. There are many people here who came to an autism diagnosis either through self diagnosis or formal diagnosis later in life. Many of us have discussed how a lens of autism can be helpful in making sense of a difficult life.

One of the most confirming informal diagnostic tools, in my experience, is reading what others have written here and learning that you identify deeply with what other people on the spectrum have experienced.

At first it can be frustrating, for me it was anyway… Realizing that I process the world completely differently than most of the people around me. In my real life, I mean. I have difficulty speaking, and prefer writing… A very common experience for people here, I learned early on.

Another revelatory thing about being on the forum, however, is the wide variety among autistic people. There are some commonalities among us, but there are so many different personalities, opinions, ideas, and experiences here that we all attempt to share with each other.

And when all that gets too confusing for our beautiful brains, there are forum games and some lighthearted fun to be had as well.

 

[nfclewley]

Thank you for your kind and wise words. I reached out on this forum for myself at first, as a cry for help for me and now for Dave. Surprisingly, I've received many comments, some of which are helpful and I've shared these with him. He seems interested in hearing what like-minded people have to say, which is encouraging for us both. He "says" he wants to have a voice here, so I hope he will, but frankly, any efforts on my part so far have been ignored, so I doubt that he will do anything, but he did want to hear (me read) the responses.
Dave is a newly diagnosed and says there's no doubt in his mind that he has ASD. That being said, it may take some time for him to decide what he wants to do to help us understand each other better. After 27 years, I'm just now getting to know my husband!

As a neurotypical, I can understand why I have hit some nerves with some of the writers within this forum. They're seeing Dave's point of view and it would be natural for them to want to defend him and I'm hoping he will tap into that support soon! I appreciate your kindness and patience with my perspective, as I search for a better way to reach my husband. Thank you!

 

[GypsyMoth]

Hello, I am new to this forum.

Hi!

My husband of 27 years has Aspergers (self-diagnosed) is a very loving and kind husband. It has been very difficult trying to find better ways to communicate. Dave is angry, negative and defensive that he has Aspergers and doesn't show any interest in working on finding solutions to our communication problems AND . . . he doesn't like change!

While I must admit to being new to ASD myself, I do know a lot about being accused of being—like you said about your husband—“angry, negative and defensive.” I’m dealing with that right now. And it’s not how I see it. So when I’m told I’m being these things, it usually catches me unawares. Usually, I think I’m happy! But that’s not what comes across. To prove this, there is an old picture I have of me, my dad, an aunt, and my grandmother. We are all smiling for the camera—but that’s not what my husband sees. Despite our all having the same expression, he sees it instead that we’re grimacing. He says, look at how you have clenched your jaw! I really didn’t see it without him pointing it out. Now, that’s not an invitation to go point out what you see as Dave’s flaws to Dave. Only, that his self perception might be different than your perception. Why don’t you ask him what he’s thinking?

We recently bought a couple of good books on Aspergers, but I'm the only one that shows interest in learning, even though I've been reading these books to him. It has been lonely and frustrating and he feels very bad that he isn't available, even though I've been very specific about what I need from him. It's like he's a ghost around me and he becomes defensive when I try to talk to him about any concerns, etc. He is 72 and I am 59, so I don't know if it's even reasonable to expect much as this point, as we're well-established in our ways.

Could it be there is something else going on than Aspergers? You’ve been specific about what you need from him. What does Dave need from you?

I’m reading (now, don’t you all laugh! It’s really been very helpful!!!) Wife School by, I think her name is Julie Gordon. It has nothing to do with ASD but is all about what we as wives can do to be a better wife. And it’s a very fun read as it’s cast as a fictional tale of a wife who inherits a genie’s lamp.

Dave has a great work ethic and still works full time. When he's home, he has his routine and he contributes when I asked, but he doesn't have any goals. The rest of the time, he "floats" around the house, bumping into me and trying to avoid me for fear of getting in the way. He doesn't have close friends or hobbies, so, besides his work, I am everything to him. Ultimately, I am like a mother or a teacher for him and not the equal partner that I should be.

Is this your perception of his? If he’s fine as he is, and you decide to pick up the slack, then that’s a decision you’ve made. That’s not on him.

I’m wondering, how much have you tried entering into Dave’s world, rather than trying to make Dave conform to your own world?

We've had a lot of discussions about his behavior prior to the realization that he has Aspergers, but nothing has helped, even when I ask him specifically for what I need from him. Oh, he's happy to do the "physical" things I ask of him; putting out the trash or the dogs, but not when it comes to his behavior. When I ask him why, he says he "doesn't know".

Maybe he has it & maybe he hasn’t. Men tend not to be as verbally self reflective as women. Would it help to instead ask Dave what he’s thinking about? Just, don’t expect him to communicate with you like a woman—men feel very insecure being drawn into those conversations and maybe even a little trapped by the way in which it’s fine.

Personally, I don’t know if Dave has ASD or not. But trying to change Dave isn’t going to help you two. Accepting Dave for who he is, as he is, will. Why not get to know Dave as he is, where he is, a little better?

Is there someone out there that can point me in the right direction? Dave won't go to an Asperger counseling and he is disinterested in the live online group sessions we recently tried. He stayed anonymous and didn't connect with the topics, as it was mostly socializing. I would really appreciate someone's advice on where to go from here. Thank you!

Natalie

Um , if anonymity is that important to him, referring to him by his first name online might feel like a breech of that anonymity. Of course, this might not be his name, in which case that’s fine.


Ps, sorry about any glaring typos or spell check corrections that stand out as odd (just caught one). I think I’ve caught them but I’m on my phone and sometimes it’s autocorrections take on a life of their own.

 

[GypsyMoth]

Just a quick thought, it might help to focus on your communication differences as a couple, first, rather than trying to fix him as an ASD.

At least, this is the direction I’m taking and so far it is helping.

 

[Aspychata]

I think Dave is depressed, because he seems to be having a lot of negative thoughts and reminds me of the lows of my bipolar ex, also overwhelmed so that he loses patience and gets angry with things easily. He might think he's over patient because there's a lot of stress he's dealing with but he's overwhelmed so externally he seems to lose patience very fast, even as soon as the interaction begins.

Maybe it's best to work on his stressers such as more quiet time, more downtime, asking his opinion on things that may create issues. If someone feels stumped in life, they can shut down, especially aspy types as they try to emotionally negotiate their world. So it's better to come from a place of understanding in dealing with him. Second thing is you need to readjust your expectations of this individual, if he hasn't changed by now, obviously change probably isn't going to happen much. So you can't just redesign individuals to your liking, that's a bit unrealistic. Change should start with you. Go out and expand your world, instead of trying to micromanage his world.

 

[Magna]

One of my favorite organizations is AANE (Asperger Autism Network). It's based on the East Coast of the U.S. but through their website, AANE.org they are accessible worldwide. They offer more resources than any other autism specific organization I've encountered.

I got an email from them today and this excerpt from the email is germane to the topic of this thread. Hopefully it can be helpful to some.

Fortunately, AANE has opportunities for neurodiverse couples to increase their understanding of each other and find support. AANE’s course 101 for Couples provides in-depth information about the way neurological differences can impact communication and intimacy. AANE also has 100+ trained and certified neurodiverse couples therapists and coaches who can help partners learn how to manage their expectations of their relationship and set aside personal time to re-charge throughout the year. Learning to better understand oneself and each other can help partners feel more comfortable and successful in handling life stressors, including the holidays.​

Through the end of December 2022, take advantage of our 35% off holiday special with promo code NEUROLOGY35 for the 101 for Couples course.​

 

[nfclewley]

Thank you!
Dave and I read what you wrote and are grateful for your help.
Dave says he would like to talk to you through writing, as we are now.
Maybe live conversation at a later date, he says.

One of my favorite organizations is AANE (Asperger Autism Network). It's based on the East Coast of the U.S. but through their website, AANE.org they are accessible worldwide. They offer more resources than any other autism specific organization I've encountered.

I got an email from them today and this excerpt from the email is germane to the topic of this thread. Hopefully it can be helpful to some.

Fortunately, AANE has opportunities for neurodiverse couples to increase their understanding of each other and find support. AANE’s course 101 for Couples provides in-depth information about the way neurological differences can impact communication and intimacy. AANE also has 100+ trained and certified neurodiverse couples therapists and coaches who can help partners learn how to manage their expectations of their relationship and set aside personal time to re-charge throughout the year. Learning to better understand oneself and each other can help partners feel more comfortable and successful in handling life stressors, including the holidays.​

Through the end of December 2022, take advantage of our 35% off holiday special with promo code NEUROLOGY35 for the 101 for Couples course.​

How nice of you to make this available to me! I really appreciate it and it sounds like good support for me. Thank you!

 

[Aspychata]

How nice of you to make this available to me! I really appreciate it and it sounds like good support for me. Thank you!

Sorry. I hope l didn't come off snarky. Sometimes it feels like everybody wants to change us to fit a box. And it's difficult. I run into this a lot, people having so many expectations for me. (Exasperation groan).

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

My wife and i have been married 31 years, a lot of times we do not speak the same language she likes to us a bit of hyperbole, I detest lying and I am very specific when I state something. she thinks it open to interpretation, as that is the way she thinks. Drives both of us nuts, as i constantly have to read between the lines to understand her. white lies, hiding the truth from her friends, rather than being up front. We have different cultures ignore at your peril, or marriage may suffer.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

Elon Musk has admitted to being one of us look at the issues it is causing him. some things money cannot buy. We live in your culture; boy is he learning a lesson. do not make his mistakes. Our cultures or at odds with each other.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Elon Musk has admitted to being one of us look at the issues it is causing him. some things money cannot buy. We live in your culture; boy is he learning a lesson. do not make his mistakes. Our cultures or at odds with each other.

Agree. Elon Musk is a good example. There people who are closest to him, understand him,...are loyal and very much supportive. However, when you have the spotlight on you,...all...the...time...and being judged in a very public way, it's easy for people to be nasty, and engage in the all too typical disinformation and reputation destruction via the media. Not to mention, most of his businesses are currently "disruptive" and will put many out of business,...trillions of dollars in current market share are at stake,...and his competitors are doing their best to spread false information through the mainstream media. It isn't until a week or so later that you find out most of last week's news about him was misrepresented and false,...then I am like,..."Well, that makes total sense. I totally get why he did that.",...but, by then, the damage to his character has already been done in the public realm. People don't understand the "out-of-the-box" or "logic" of an autistic mind,...that has been shown in a number of psychological studies,...we think and do differently,...I do, for sure,...and it has been to my advantage,...and clearly to Elon's in many respects. However, like so many of us, we "fly under the radar",...and Elon's every move is being judged from a neurotypical perspective,...and they are all too quick to get their "little panties in a bunch" every time he makes a very necessary and logical business move.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I Agee, how he acts makes perfect sense to me even his obsession with free speech, got himself so locked in now he is finally seeing the downside. like all of us on the spectrum we like to see words as if it was mathematics, based on logic, unfortunately that's not the way language works. I saw my older brother fall in this trap, he loved philosophy, I guess trying to make language follow the rules of mathematics. Either way I'm not a fan of Elon or his fellow billionaire Aspie Zuckerberg, who has a similar outlook. IT seems ironic the social sites are owned and controlled by Aspies who have issues in this area. I would hate to be an owner of a company; I could see myself in both these guys either your perfect in the way you perform your job or leave. after all, that's what I would do myself. The real world does not work that way. My wife was exemplary employee, but her filing skills do not remotely match mime. if she worked in an office with me, she would not last a day.

 

[All-Rounder]

@nfclewley

You've received some good information and insight from older, experienced forum members. I won't add to it.
I have only one comment for now, and it's been stated differently already. But it's something I believe you should seriously think about:

In general, asking an Aspie how they "feel" about something is not going to produce a meaningful answer, and is very likely to be a source of considerable stress.

The "why" is simple, and you know the words already - but you don't understand them: we literally don't think the same way as you do.

You can force an Aspie to provide fake answers, but you cannot get what you want. Human brains cannot be "rewired".

It's a known fact that question is not successful with aspies. I have read about alternatives but can't recall them anymore. Basically asking in terms of "what do you think" instead of feelings is better, simpler for the autistic brain, it is familiar to not automatically be socially adapted but have to do a lot of thinking about social things. Some functions which neurotypicals can do automatically, the aspie brain can't.

 

[All-Rounder]

Hello Natalie,

Your list in OP appear to be things YOU want, not Dave.

"doesn't like change" - he doesn't have to.

"doesn't have any goals" - he's been okay for 70 odd years without any.

"No interest in finding solutions to comms problems" - perhaps comms are okay according to him?

He's tried the Aspie counselling, doesn't work for him.
(He may have gone along with it to try to keep you happy)

you write you feel "like a mother or teacher" - so stop doing it.

when he answers he doesn't know why... he'll be telling you the truth.

Perhaps it's you that requires the assistance (therapy etc) to help you with your frustrations, changes, way forward through the next 27 years as your post reads like a list of things you need, Not Dave.

Agreed, and I think I know where that stems from. I've been through the same thing many times before.

When my partners would not come up with ideas or communicate, I felt forced to plan and work on it by myself. When you plan by yourself not knowing what the other wants or doesn't want, and are also desperate to fulfill your needs in the relationship it tends to happen more often than not. You give up on trying to figure it out sometimes because really, the partner needs to talk, because you can't know if they don't open up, so flaw is imperative here for the lack of progress. Also when they say they don't know, does it mean that all things are equal? Regardless of how logical that would seem, it's not. They have likes and dislikes but moods too, I think it's about moods when they say 'i don't know what I would like to do.' when they're depressed and say they don't like or want anything, if you're used to planning, it's hard to leave it at that. What does that mean we should do anyway? 'nothing' practically doesn't really exist, so.

Keep asking and you don't know what you're doing, feels alone and endless rejection, while the person won't contribute. Say one word would help into adding to preferences. She doesn't know him enough and the emotionality of the situation makes even what she knows hazy. But the unusual answers confuse even more and affect the confidence in the relationship, you become convinced there's nothing you know and no way to find out.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

I Agee, how he acts makes perfect sense to me even his obsession with free speech, got himself so locked in now he is finally seeing the downside. like all of us on the spectrum we like to see words as if it was mathematics, based on logic, unfortunately that's not the way language works. I saw my older brother fall in this trap, he loved philosophy, I guess trying to make language follow the rules of mathematics. Either way I'm not a fan of Elon or his fellow billionaire Aspie Zuckerberg, who has a similar outlook. IT seems ironic the social sites are owned and controlled by Aspies who have issues in this area. I would hate to be an owner of a company; I could see myself in both these guys either your perfect in the way you perform your job or leave. after all, that's what I would do myself. The real world does not work that way. My wife was exemplary employee, but her filing skills do not remotely match mime. if she worked in an office with me, she would not last a day.

I think another factor with social media that gets overlooked,...social media has NO way of "wrangling in" the 3% of the general population that are true, narcissistic psychopaths,...nor the sociopaths (don't know the %). These people may be the "trolls", or the people who make provocative, divisive, misrepresentative, and false claims that get the masses on these platforms engaged in false narratives, conspiracy theories, etc. People, in general, tend to be "intellectually lazy". Most don't fact check. Most react in this emotional fashion with their cognitive biases in full display. Very much like when the Joker said to Batman,..."All they need is a little push."

I think Musk and Zuckerberg understand this,...but not sure if they fully understand what that means in terms of "free speech" within society,...or how to deal with it on a social media platform where a small percentage of psychopaths and sociopaths can have significant influence over the narrative.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

Personally, I do not use either of these social media platforms this is the only site I use.

 

[Neonatal RRT]

Personally, I do not use either of these social media platforms this is the only site I use.

Same here.

 

[Ronald Zeeman]

I'M also on LinkedIn, do not use it, being retired, easy to contact friends and relatives.

 

[GypsyMoth]

I'm on LinkedIn. But it was only after I found work that it started getting looked at.

Go figure.

 

[All-Rounder]

"one third of people with AsPD meet the criteria for psychopathy." - Does every psychopath have an antisocial personality disorder?

That would mean that 9% = AsPD. Diagnosed ones? The undiagnosed add to it.

Which means a lot more are prone to violent and remorseless malignant behaviour, since those traits are definitory to Antisocial PD. Mood disorders are also more common.

It is different from Narcissistic PD where they might have similar but non-violent malignant behaviours but an affected sense of remorse, and manipulative intention, as well as a lack of understanding and viewing others the same as themselves, having their own needs as well as having their own importance. Delusions of grandeur, being more than they actually are.

If we take into account mistreatment, disrespect and use from NTs, there are a lot that actually do it, too. There are good and nice people in the world, if you try to notice them, but so many are addicted to their negative selfish ways and feel good doing it.