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Giving tips

Then they need to charge the customer more for the service to cover the costs, which would work out the same for the customer as they have to pay more when they pay the tip anyway. If a customer accepts to pay a tip so that the staff can earn a decent living, then they should be happy to pay a little extra on the charge for a service where they know that they staff is being treated and paid fairly. I find it unacceptable that staff should be hired and paid such a low wage by their employer, so that they have to rely on tips. There is no excuse IMO for not paying staff at least the minimum wage. IMO, all countries should have a law requiring a minimum legal wage, and then enforce that law.
I think the issue in this thread is that we are all from different counties, with different laws, regulations and working conditions, so we are coming at this from different angles. You are talking about the USA and conditions which exist there, but it isn't the same everywhere. As said previously, where I live, things are different and not quite so clear cut: a minimum legal wage exists, and tips are appreciated by staff, but not manditory or automatically expected as they are in the USA. Eating out is perhaps more expensive where I live, but staff receive a minimum wage by the hour, and it is not required to tip, if one does, about 10% or just some small change. In the USA, that might be frowned upon or seen as an insult, but not here. They get the minimum wage already and are grateful for any extra cash. Businesses go bust if they don't offer good service or hygiene, or if they overprice, or don't attract enough customers, just like any business anywhere in the world. Restaurants with hired staff usually charge more and are of higher quality than family-run businesses, which tend to be cheaper, but more basic.
That makes perfect sense about different countries with different cultures where they may or may not have a minimum wage and people here coming at this from different angles. I understand that in some countries such as France waiting staff get paid very little or sometimes even nothing at all because everyone is expected to pay a tip and staff can easily make a good wage from tips alone, if you don't tip there it's seen as a real insult, probably a lot worse than in the USA and you'd only not tip if you were so dissatisfied that you wanted to make a big point about it. Tipping cultures can vary greatly from country to country so much that if anyone travels abroad and they aren't sure of the local customs, I advise them to do their research beforehand because they could be expected to tip a minimum acceptable amount for things that are often not tipped for at all back at home and sometimes there are other differing customs that maybe insulting if they're not respected and followed too.

In the UK not everyone tips and there is a national minimum wage, although some restaurants have fixed tips on the bill and probably more than 50% of people tip in restaurants where you are waited upon, while no-one usually tips in places like McDonalds, Burger King or any other fast food or resturant. A lot of UK people don't tip taxis and it's not seen as an insult if you don't either, with cash fares it's common for people to round the price up and say keep the change, but with Uber where it's taken from people's bank or card directly it's probably less common. Similarly in barbers, some people tip or round the price up, but a lot of people don't and it's not seen as any sort of insult. In bars only a very small few tip in the UK, a bar man often won't take a tip for an entire shift in a busy bar, although a nice looking bar maid will often take more from men chatting them up (I know from past experience working in a bar), bar staff are probably more likely to get a tip in higher class places such as posh hotels. So generally in the UK as tip is a bonus that isn't automatically expected.
 
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Then they need to charge the customer more for the service to cover the costs, which would work out the same for the customer as they have to pay more when they pay the tip anyway. If a customer accepts to pay a tip so that the staff can earn a decent living, then they should be happy to pay a little extra on the charge for a service where they know that they staff is being treated and paid fairly. I find it unacceptable that staff should be hired and paid such a low wage by their employer, so that they have to rely on tips. There is no excuse IMO for not paying staff at least the minimum wage. IMO, all countries should have a law requiring a minimum legal wage, and then enforce that law.
I think the issue in this thread is that we are all from different counties, with different laws, regulations and working conditions, so we are coming at this from different angles. You are talking about the USA and conditions which exist there, but it isn't the same everywhere. As said previously, where I live, things are different and not quite so clear cut: a minimum legal wage exists, and tips are appreciated by staff, but not manditory or automatically expected as they are in the USA. Eating out is perhaps more expensive where I live, but staff receive a minimum wage by the hour, and it is not required to tip, if one does, about 10% or just some small change. In the USA, that might be frowned upon or seen as an insult, but not here. They get the minimum wage already and are grateful for any extra cash. Businesses go bust if they don't offer good service or hygiene, or if they overprice, or don't attract enough customers, just like any business anywhere in the world. Restaurants with hired staff usually charge more and are of higher quality than family-run businesses, which tend to be cheaper, but more basic.
I get it.
Your ideas are flawless and fair.


I really don't think y'all get it.

You are talking about sit down restaurants where the clientele are served one on one.
It requires a better atmosphere where a merit based system rewards better service, but at the same time allows a customer to reflect dissatisfaction with say a foul and nasty experience at a place where one expects to be treated better due to the prices they are willing to pay for it in the first place.


I have a friend who does not get paid a minimum wage that makes much more from her tips than any restaurant employer could ever afford to pay her, so there in lies the first major flaw in a system where there are no longer tips.

She brings home a yearly average of about $1250 a week based on her service, something her employer might not be able to support during slow business weeks.

She would lose money, plain and simple.

If you have hired a bunch of turds who are running your business into the ground, how do you propose you fix it?

Oh yeah, fire them, or go bankrupt.
Either way, someone loses money in the end.
If you fire someone based on poor performance, isn't that the same as not rewarding them for poor performance by not leaving them a tip for it?

Oh yeah, keep in mind the red tape you have to wade thru to fire an employee.
Don't get it right and the disgruntled former employee takes you to task for it and wins in a system that is generally biased towards the worker and not the employer, your Federal Unemployment Tax Act rate takes a hit when they file for unemployment and get rewarded with it.
The worker doesn't pay that tax,the employer does.


I had a guy that worked for me who was dragging his skates at his job who I had to take into my office several times as a result of his poor performance that put his hands on his hips and told me "You do it your way and I'll do it my way, however long it takes,that's how long it takes, so you can kiss my entire ass"

I fired him on the spot based on insubordination.
He appealed to the unemployment office for his unemployment.
He won.
I lost.
Several times over and in the end.


In the USA with our system of tipping, if you are bad at that job, your are not compensated the same as the rest of the staff,you lose money for not satisfying your customers.

That is the incentive to shine like the brightest star in that type of setting.


If you cannot afford to go to a pricier setting here, you have the option of takeout, where there are required minimum wages paid and there is no need to tip.

You are absolutely correct,we are from different cultures.
 
Whoa. I think there's a fundamental misunderstanding going on here.

Realize that there is a minimum wage in the US, but servers at restaurants are allowed to be paid less than minimum wage, because their profession is tipped. The powers that be bake the waitress' tip money into their pay, assuming it will about equal minimum wage.

It really seems quite evil to me, but a fine example of how the working poor are kept that way.
 
Sorry,it's called sarcasm.
It's totally uncalled for. You can see that there is a difference of opinion arising from two people belong to two different backgounds, absolutely no need for snide remarks and sarcasm. I have just as much a right to my opinion as you have. My opinion is valid and I ask that you treat me with respect. Having a diifferent opinion does not give you the right to disrespect me.

That's all I have to say on the matter.
 
It's totally uncalled for. You can see that there is a difference of opinion arising from two people belong to two different backgounds, absolutely no need for snide remarks and sarcasm. I have just as much a right to my opinion as you have. My opinion is valid and I ask that you treat me with respect. Having a diifferent opinion does not give you the right to disrespect me.

That's all I have to say on the matter.
I'm sorry, I am human and not without flaws.
 
Let's face it. What divides two or more peoples is not only the distance between the two sides of "the pond", but also how deep it can be.

Clearly there are some very contrasting perspectives over tips, relative to other issues reflecting cultural traditions and conventions apart from political and economic differences.

Where at some points we just have to agree to disagree and leave it at that.
 
I get it.
Your ideas are flawless and fair.


I really don't think y'all get it.

You are talking about sit down restaurants where the clientele are served one on one.
It requires a better atmosphere where a merit based system rewards better service, but at the same time allows a customer to reflect dissatisfaction with say a foul and nasty experience at a place where one expects to be treated better due to the prices they are willing to pay for it in the first place.


I have a friend who does not get paid a minimum wage that makes much more from her tips than any restaurant employer could ever afford to pay her, so there in lies the first major flaw in a system where there are no longer tips.

She brings home a yearly average of about $1250 a week based on her service, something her employer might not be able to support during slow business weeks.

She would lose money, plain and simple.

If you have hired a bunch of turds who are running your business into the ground, how do you propose you fix it?

Oh yeah, fire them, or go bankrupt.
Either way, someone loses money in the end.
If you fire someone based on poor performance, isn't that the same as not rewarding them for poor performance by not leaving them a tip for it?

Oh yeah, keep in mind the red tape you have to wade thru to fire an employee.
Don't get it right and the disgruntled former employee takes you to task for it and wins in a system that is generally biased towards the worker and not the employer, your Federal Unemployment Tax Act rate takes a hit when they file for unemployment and get rewarded with it.
The worker doesn't pay that tax,the employer does.


I had a guy that worked for me who was dragging his skates at his job who I had to take into my office several times as a result of his poor performance that put his hands on his hips and told me "You do it your way and I'll do it my way, however long it takes,that's how long it takes, so you can kiss my entire ass"

I fired him on the spot based on insubordination.
He appealed to the unemployment office for his unemployment.
He won.
I lost.
Several times over and in the end.


In the USA with our system of tipping, if you are bad at that job, your are not compensated the same as the rest of the staff,you lose money for not satisfying your customers.

That is the incentive to shine like the brightest star in that type of setting.


If you cannot afford to go to a pricier setting here, you have the option of takeout, where there are required minimum wages paid and there is no need to tip.

You are absolutely correct,we are from different cultures.
Is she a nice looking young lady? I ask this because when I worked behind the bar many years ago only the nice looking barmaids got tips, while barmen who worked just as hard barely ever got anything, but at least the manager made everyone split the tips equally because he recognised that it was extremely unfair. If she is a nice looking woman, do other people that aren't as nice looking or men get many tips? If not and they work just as hard it's extremely unfair and if there must be tips they should be split equally whether she earns a lot less money or not, this is just one reason why I hate tips. It's a difficult situation now because she is used to earning so much in tips and now she's living within those means even though she's earning a lot more than that position normally pays, in fact she's probably earning more than the chefs who of course never gets tips no matter how hard and well they work. It would have been much better to pay a fair wage in the first place and this situation would never have happened.
 
As far as kitchen workers not always sharing the cut of the front line tips, they had the same opportunities as the servers to gain those positions, so that point is moot.

Kitchen workers most never have the “same opportunities” as the servers to gain those positions”. NEVER!

Servers are hired by different criteria and experience. Kitchen workers like dishwashers and busboys are at the bottom of the job heap- they often are non- English speaking immigrants, and make the least amount of money, and do the sweatiest, dirtiest jobs. They do not speak to customers, usually have lowered to no education, can have felony backgrounds, and in no way could ever be hired for serving. I speak from experience.
 
Polio was eradicated a few decades ago where I live. What i would normally give in tips, I give to the maimed for life--those who contracted polio before the vaccine became widespread. The extremely physically disabled, having small and contorted limbs, hang out by the churches near the central market. It is customary tomdo so. I don't have much money, given that I recieve disability. I work hard these days, as hard or harder than I did in the ten years I served the system.

Sometimes, I like to tip. And sometimes they are appreciated. At times, tips can be viewed as an insult: I tried to give the ice cream man a tip a year ago, and he didn't appreciate it. Though I've been screamed at for not giving a tip for take out food (no one tips for take out in Mexico).

In some situations, I give tips to avoid a problem, though it might seem they have more money than me and has fewer mouths to feed. It is often hard to tell all at a glance, though.
 
Harry the rideshareguy sent me another email and I feel it’s a great tip. Can you get someone who, is not autistic that you trust, go along with you on your Uber rides? Note where he mentioned being “pleasant.” I am wondering if your low ratings are about shouting, sounding aggressive, and of course, not tipping. Can you work on any of those issues? Are you even willing to work on those issues? It’s up to you now.

This is what Harry sent me:

“It sounds like a difficult situation - in many cases, she will get a ride eventually, especially if she's in a city. Some drivers don't care about passenger ratings and will pick up everyone.

Are you able to ride with her once or twice and see what she's doing that's earning her a low rating? Some drivers do give a 1 star rating to passengers who don't tip, but not all drivers are like that. Many drivers will give passengers 5 star ratings if they are pleasant, even if they don't tip.

I would try to go with her on rides and see if you can offer some suggestions to her to raise her rating, including tipping.”
Was this meant for @pjcnet ? He's the one who was talking about Uber drivers and tipping, not me.
 

Exactly.
“Out for a meal and getting served by someone? You’re in for a tip. While tipping isn’t necessarily “compulsory” in this setting, expect to add at least 15 to 20 percent of the bill (closer to 25 per cent if you’re dining somewhere high end).”

Tipping in my region is pretty compulsory, especially if returning to same restaurants. 20% in Chicago is standard, but maybe in a small town it’s less.
Anyone remember that scene in Fight Club where Brad Pitt pees on the plate of food before it’s served???
 
Prompted by @pjcnet 's thread on Uber drivers, I wanted to ask you what you thoughts are on the practice of tipping - giving extra money on top of the advertised price for services, in taxis or in restuarants, for example. Do you give tips? Do you think it's right to do so?

Employees shouldn't have to rely on tips to make a decent living, they should be paid a decent wage from the start. The price of a service should be up front and transparent, no hidden costs: the advertised price is the price you pay. You agree to a price before accepting the service, that is the price you should be expected to pay, not more.

Just thought to post this. Please read. Drivers certainly need their tips.
What's The Real Commission That Uber Takes From Its Drivers? [Infographic]
 

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