Developing a marketplace for ASD artists, craftspeople, and businesses

[gonzerd]

I've been wanting to chime on this thread since I first saw it, but wanted to think about it a bit first.

See, apart from that it'd be great to have an Aspie oriented marketplace/Etsy alternative, I think the really great value in this could be in bringing people and their respective skills together, making these skills available to each other, rather than in just offering another platform to sell finished products, because that in itself doesn't necessarily address some of the recurring problems that (Aspie) artists/artisans/developers/the like face, in my experience.

Selling things online, turning it into a successful business generating a decent income, involves so much more than just being able to make something. It requires a whole range of skills, some of which the creators might not have, and might not be able to acquire due to all kinds of often common issues.

Say you have dyslexia or dysgraphia? Good luck at writing up some good copy to advertise your product. Or reading and responding to client emails. Even if it's just a matter of social anxiety, trouble communicating; you might overcome it, but it will take away so much time, time that can be better spent focussing on your main skill set, on your actual product. Product photography could be another example (although that would take some geographical proximity). You can create something beautiful, but making it look good in pictures, on screen, is an entirely different matter. Someone might be a genius at writing code and make a fantastic app, but if that person lacks the skills to also design the interface elements, chances are it will just go unnoticed. What if you're a great composer or illustrator and you do get job offers, but you find it incredibly difficult to negotiate prices and contract details?

Those are all hurdles that might not be obvious at first, but have to be overcome at some point. And you can learn, but that's sometimes not an option, or simply takes too long. And when you're socially isolated for example, finding people to help with these things, to delegate parts of the process to, can be damn near impossible.

And that's, I think, where the real objective should be, what the real differentiating factor can be; in somehow providing options to overcome those hurdles, by bringing skills together for example, by making them available towards each other. So people can focus on what they do best, or at least find some help to fill in that one missing link in the whole chain of actions that is selling something, be it a product or a skill, online. People should still be able to work as independent as they wish, but finding that extra bit of help, and help in dealing with the legalities of working together, can make a huge difference.

And I'm sure that there are Aspies (or non-Aspies, doesn't matter) who excel at any of these skills. Some are great at negotiating, at dealing with customers, at writing copy, etc... and who would love nothing better than to indulge in their specific skill.

How all of this can be done, I don't know. Setting up a basic easily accessible network, with proper support would already go a long way. How things like getting paid, mutual contracts and stuff would work... I have no idea. Just thought I'd mention it because that's where the actual problem lies, in my experience. Not in not having an online marketplace, but in making good and efficient use of it, and in having a marketplace not just to sell products, but to market our skills.

(A little personal rant: I followed a basic business and accounting course, which is a legal requirement here to set-up certain kinds of businesses; making a business plan and stuff like that, networking with the teachers to help you set things up. But when you're just a painter for example, trying to sell your work, those things are for the most part useless. It's good to know the legal/tax implications, but for most artisans/artists it's just something to get bogged down in. It's just not that kind of business. They gave great info on what type of licenses I'd need if I want to sell food or alcohol, and how to write off a company car, but copyright law for instance was something they knew nothing about.)

That's it for now. Maybe it's been mentioned before already and I overlooked it. I'd love to help out with this somehow, if only by making use of it when it's there, but the next 3 months or so I'll be too busy moving and such anyway.

 

[watersprite]

gonzerd this is so astute and has stated exactly what I was feeling and could not put to words. I can not interact nor set prices nor do I know how to copyright my art and definitely cannot discuss my art. In the past people have just taken it, and used it for free. Which is a compliment but it is also what makes me reluctant to try again. I still want to sell it and feel fairly confident that it will sell. But as you said, all the other stuff.....

 

[Stopheles]

I love this entire idea. I have a friend who is also on the spectrum and I am helping him market his work. I studied marketing and am excellent at producing ad copy and pricing. I would love to help any way I can once my skills are needed!

 

[Effy]

I work with an independent webhosting company and may be able to get the site hosted at a huge discount/for free, depending on the needs. I'm the Partnership Manager and VP of Social Media.

Others have already explained the necessary legal aspects of the marketplace, so the only concern I really have left is an SSL certificate.

On a side note, if you guys wished to make a marketplace, would it be a for-profit business or a nonprofit business/organization?

 

[Nadador]

I'm grateful for all of the feedback offered here, and for Slithy's work with the attorney.

A lot has happened on AC since this thread started. It's got me thinking that this project might best be approached from a different angle, as one piece of a much larger effort that would consequently bring it more exposure. I'm not prepared to reveal my ideas just yet, but suffice it to say I've scheduled a meeting in early April, with another Aspie "celebrity" who has an interest in helping the community. He has a bigger name and a fatter wallet than mine. If we can agree on a vision, I'll have plenty to talk about shortly thereafter.

I've asked Slithy to forward a summary of all of your thoughts and suggestions, for me to hold onto. I hate to have revved everyone up just to put on the brakes, but if I can make this into something more powerful, I'd say it will have been worth it.

 

[SignOfLazarus]

See, apart from that it'd be great to have an Aspie oriented marketplace/Etsy alternative, I think the really great value in this could be in bringing people and their respective skills together, making these skills available to each other, rather than in just offering another platform to sell finished products, because that in itself doesn't necessarily address some of the recurring problems that (Aspie) artists/artisans/developers/the like face, in my experience.

Selling things online, turning it into a successful business generating a decent income, involves so much more than just being able to make something. It requires a whole range of skills, some of which the creators might not have, and might not be able to acquire due to all kinds of often common issues...
Those are all hurdles that might not be obvious at first, but have to be overcome at some point. And you can learn, but that's sometimes not an option, or simply takes too long. And when you're socially isolated for example, finding people to help with these things, to delegate parts of the process to, can be damn near impossible.

And that's, I think, where the real objective should be, what the real differentiating factor can be; in somehow providing options to overcome those hurdles, by bringing skills together for example, by making them available towards each other. So people can focus on what they do best, or at least find some help to fill in that one missing link in the whole chain of actions that is selling something, be it a product or a skill, online. People should still be able to work as independent as they wish, but finding that extra bit of help, and help in dealing with the legalities of working together, can make a huge difference.

And I'm sure that there are Aspies (or non-Aspies, doesn't matter) who excel at any of these skills. Some are great at negotiating, at dealing with customers, at writing copy, etc... and who would love nothing better than to indulge in their specific skill...

How all of this can be done, I don't know. Setting up a basic easily accessible network, with proper support would already go a long way. How things like getting paid, mutual contracts and stuff would work... I have no idea. Just thought I'd mention it because that's where the actual problem lies, in my experience. Not in not having an online marketplace, but in making good and efficient use of it, and in having a marketplace not just to sell products, but to market our skills...

I agree with all of this- there is more to it than simply having a product to sell. Writing copy, interacting with customers, etc etc etc. I am not sure, entirely, what kind of endeavor this is shaping up to be. If more of a definite company- there should be individuals who can do this- preferably on the spectrum honestly, and it would make sense if they receive some kind of compensation if at all possible.

My reason for this suggestion is that there are a number of people on this cite who have the skills needed for this, have trouble getting work or working outside of their house or in a typical job, and could benefit. I do think people should get compensated for work they do as much as possible. [This is only a suggestion, I'm not really pushing on it- I don't know how feasible it is because I'm a little bit lost on precisely what direction this is going in and apologies for that]

I feel a bit odd suggesting that because I haven't been involved in this discussion and, to be completely transparent- if that were an opportunity I would love to be involved. So I'll make that position clear because I'm not "trying to pull a fast one". But... again, ya know... I'm also not trying to push people out of the way or be bossy. Even if there were no compensation it's still a project I'd want to be involved in to that end.

 

[The Penguin]

Selling things online, turning it into a successful business generating a decent income, involves so much more than just being able to make something. It requires a whole range of skills, some of which the creators might not have, and might not be able to acquire due to all kinds of often common issues.

Indeed. Some of you might know I started my own business when I was living in Ontario and was not successful. I had nothing to do with not having a good product. Well, in my case it would be service as I develop software. I had happy customers. The problem arises of me not having enough customers to live on. Living in Nova Scotia and giving it a second try, I'm thinking about all the mistakes I made in the past and how I can do better this time? A few big mistakes I made was one, I didn't have a well defined market. Two, I was not effective in networking and was not attending the right events. From all of this, I'm doing a lot better and I got more support within 4 months than what I received in the two years running a business in Ontario. Many people are not successful in business on their first try. However, it's a learning experience. The key thing, learn and do better next time. A better move is to connect with the right people, get great advice and succeed on the first try.

Say you have dyslexia or dysgraphia? Good luck at writing up some good copy to advertise your product. Or reading and responding to client emails. Even if it's just a matter of social anxiety, trouble communicating; you might overcome it, but it will take away so much time, time that can be better spent focusing on your main skill set, on your actual product.

Well, for many of you know I have a language base learning disability. This does not stop me starting a business. It does take me longer to read and write. There are times I need people to proofread content for me. However, me having the right support, I can still be very successful. There many people in business not great in writing and reading yet still have a successful business. So if you struggle with writing and reading, but can still offer a good product and service, go for it. All you need to do is find people to help with your weaknesses and then you might, the key word, is might lead to success. The reason I'm stressing the word MIGHT is, even a person excels in reading and writing can still fail in business. Anyhow, to end this paragraph, if your not willing to take risks, DON'T START A BUSINESS!

 

[Nadador]

...(edit) I think the really great value in this could be in bringing people and their respective skills together, making these skills available to each other, rather than in just offering another platform to sell finished products, because that in itself doesn't necessarily address some of the recurring problems that (Aspie) artists/artisans/developers/the like face, in my experience...(edit)

...(edit) How all of this can be done, I don't know...(edit)

My original vision was to offer assistance with setting up accounts, and presenting products in their best light, as a complimentary service to sellers. How we would manage this would be worked out later, of course, as there are so many steps to be taken, many of which would come before that decision would have to be made.

It sounds like what you're recommending is something beyond that, and actually, to me, even more interesting. It seems as though you're suggesting we use the site for networking and mutual aid, going further than just helping sellers post their goods. Am I correct?

That's certainly something worth thinking about. I would ideally like to see the most good for the most people, not restricted to the benefit of artists and craftspeople. That piece has been eluding me somewhat, however. It would be good to do more than just offer advertising space.

I do think people should get compensated for work they do as much as possible.

The trouble with compensating people for the early work of planning and development is that at this juncture, it appears as though it would fall entirely on me, as the principal investor, to pay for it. I don't want to seem stingy, but as this is envisioned as a non-profit that would not charge any fees to sellers, I would rather see the site come together, launch, and have a little time to catch on before I start paying for labour. If I am to contribute financially by paying the basic costs of start-up and maintenance, for the greater good, I would hope there would be people willing to contribute their skills in the same spirit.

What some of the comments here are indicating is that I may need to rethink the no-fee policy. I'm not prepared to discuss it yet. It's just another aspect that may need further consideration. That was why I wasn't averse to Slithy putting my idea up for comment. She rightly believed that it needed a bit of group dissection.

Re-reading this, I want to be sure it's clear that I'm not at all offended by your suggestion. I'm just putting it in perspective. Well, my perspective, at any rate.

 

[SignOfLazarus]

Apologies- I don't believe I was clear in what I meant people should be compensated for.
I meant, people who might consistently work on the site as managing [<--- nope didn't meant that either. I' not having a good word day. :/]
So example, assisting with engagement with customers, helping with writing copy as a steady and reliable function, that kind of thing.

Not initial set up. That's quite difficult, I agree.
I think, however, if in the long run there turns out to be a need for what I mentioned, which was mentioned also in another post, it makes sense to compensate them if they regularly contribute to that end.

Helping to set up and establish something, it's kind of difficult to do that though even in terms of logistics.

...yeah I am having trouble using my words ha.

 

[Nadador]

I think, however, if in the long run there turns out to be a need for what I mentioned, which was mentioned also in another post, it makes sense to compensate them if they regularly contribute to that end.

You make perfect sense, and yes, that's something I assumed would be necessary, once the site gained traction.

 

[Aspergirl4hire]

FWIW, I'm a compulsive writer. I'm sure that surprises exactly no one.

 

[AsheSkyler]

I've been wanting to chime on this thread since I first saw it, but wanted to think about it a bit first.

See, apart from that it'd be great to have an Aspie oriented marketplace/Etsy alternative, I think the really great value in this could be in bringing people and their respective skills together, making these skills available to each other, rather than in just offering another platform to sell finished products, because that in itself doesn't necessarily address some of the recurring problems that (Aspie) artists/artisans/developers/the like face, in my experience.

Selling things online, turning it into a successful business generating a decent income, involves so much more than just being able to make something. It requires a whole range of skills, some of which the creators might not have, and might not be able to acquire due to all kinds of often common issues.

Say you have dyslexia or dysgraphia? Good luck at writing up some good copy to advertise your product. Or reading and responding to client emails. Even if it's just a matter of social anxiety, trouble communicating; you might overcome it, but it will take away so much time, time that can be better spent focussing on your main skill set, on your actual product. Product photography could be another example (although that would take some geographical proximity). You can create something beautiful, but making it look good in pictures, on screen, is an entirely different matter. Someone might be a genius at writing code and make a fantastic app, but if that person lacks the skills to also design the interface elements, chances are it will just go unnoticed. What if you're a great composer or illustrator and you do get job offers, but you find it incredibly difficult to negotiate prices and contract details?

Those are all hurdles that might not be obvious at first, but have to be overcome at some point. And you can learn, but that's sometimes not an option, or simply takes too long. And when you're socially isolated for example, finding people to help with these things, to delegate parts of the process to, can be damn near impossible.

And that's, I think, where the real objective should be, what the real differentiating factor can be; in somehow providing options to overcome those hurdles, by bringing skills together for example, by making them available towards each other. So people can focus on what they do best, or at least find some help to fill in that one missing link in the whole chain of actions that is selling something, be it a product or a skill, online. People should still be able to work as independent as they wish, but finding that extra bit of help, and help in dealing with the legalities of working together, can make a huge difference.

And I'm sure that there are Aspies (or non-Aspies, doesn't matter) who excel at any of these skills. Some are great at negotiating, at dealing with customers, at writing copy, etc... and who would love nothing better than to indulge in their specific skill.

How all of this can be done, I don't know. Setting up a basic easily accessible network, with proper support would already go a long way. How things like getting paid, mutual contracts and stuff would work... I have no idea. Just thought I'd mention it because that's where the actual problem lies, in my experience. Not in not having an online marketplace, but in making good and efficient use of it, and in having a marketplace not just to sell products, but to market our skills.

(A little personal rant: I followed a basic business and accounting course, which is a legal requirement here to set-up certain kinds of businesses; making a business plan and stuff like that, networking with the teachers to help you set things up. But when you're just a painter for example, trying to sell your work, those things are for the most part useless. It's good to know the legal/tax implications, but for most artisans/artists it's just something to get bogged down in. It's just not that kind of business. They gave great info on what type of licenses I'd need if I want to sell food or alcohol, and how to write off a company car, but copyright law for instance was something they knew nothing about.)

That's it for now. Maybe it's been mentioned before already and I overlooked it. I'd love to help out with this somehow, if only by making use of it when it's there, but the next 3 months or so I'll be too busy moving and such anyway.

Quite!

I should really hope we'd have a diverse enough marketplace to have listings for the more writing and marketing inclined. A section dedicated strictly to the Aspie agents and their services would be a good idea. But would they just be part of the staff, would they just have their own listings, or would they do both? Hrm...
One reason I'm not good at marketing is that I have low tolerance for egotistical buzzwords like "I'm the most awesomest artisan ever and you'd be an idiot to use anybody else". I hate those kinds of advertisements. But I don't know how to make a polite version that catches folks' attention more regularly.

A section dedicated to copyright law would be nice, that is one murky piece of chaos.

 

[Aspergirl4hire]

Quite!

...One reason I'm not good at marketing is that I have low tolerance for egotistical buzzwords like "I'm the most awesomest artisan ever and you'd be an idiot to use anybody else". I hate those kinds of advertisements. But I don't know how to make a polite version that catches folks' attention more regularly.

A section dedicated to copyright law would be nice, that is one murky piece of chaos.

I just came back from a conference on marketing. There are aspects of it I like, since there's been a developing spectrum from advertisement to testimonial to "advertorial" and now customer storytelling. The ability to use tools for fiction while cherishing a passion for the facts that matter doesn't favor snake oil salemen, or people who flash labels because they can't appreciate design.

 

[gonzerd]

First, nice to see I'm not alone with those suggestions I posted earlier. I'm putting together a proper reply with some elaborations and what I think could be real life examples, but it's still a bit scattered for now, so I'll have to punch my thoughts into coherence first. There's already a lot being said here, I don't want to come in and spread confusion with a bunch of wild ideas.