Emotions and therapy?

[LittleFiddle05]

So, last week my psychologist said something that really got me thinking, and I'm curious to hear what others have experienced.

I've had a few traumatizing experiences this year (most notably, finding my roommate after she committed suicide). It took weeks to tell my psychologist everything, but I finally did; after finishing, she listed 6 things that she thinks we'll need to address; I asked "Okay, how do we address them?" Two weeks later, she brought up that conversation and said it had really thrown her off; she said that I respond to therapy differently than anyone else she's ever treated. Apparently, usually after a traumatic event, the patient wants to talk about it every week, and every week she guides them to reframe the event to alter the memory; the facts stay the same, but the emotions become less harmful and more empowering. She described it as a normalizing process. Except, apparently the weird thing about me is, I don't volunteer emotional details; despite the amount of time it took to explain everything, my explanations remained factual; sometimes she'd ask about emotions and I'd answer quickly, but it seemed mostly irrelevant. She said that from what she's seeing and hearing, it seems like I don't have strong emotional ties to the facts; I can analyze my reactions, analyze what happened, I'm good at explaining what I feel if asked... but when I remember an event, emotions seem hardly relevant. Because of this she's not quite sure how to proceed, because she's not sure her usual mode of treatment would actually make any difference for me. She doesn't know whether it's an Aspie thing, or just a me thing.

Overall, I'm just curious; for those here who see a psychologist, counselor, etc, do you naturally incorporate emotions into your stories, or do you need to be prompted to give such information?

 

[Loomis]

When I was a child, a small boy was killed by a car in my neighborhood in Chicago. I watched firemen put him into a body bag. I can play the movie in my head but there are no emotions, just pictures with some rather grisly details. I never told my family what I saw. I did not feel the need to tell anyone.

 

[Peace]

So, last week my psychologist said something that really got me thinking, and I'm curious to hear what others have experienced.

I've had a few traumatizing experiences this year (most notably, finding my roommate after she committed suicide). It took weeks to tell my psychologist everything, but I finally did; after finishing, she listed 6 things that she thinks we'll need to address; I asked "Okay, how do we address them?" Two weeks later, she brought up that conversation and said it had really thrown her off; she said that I respond to therapy differently than anyone else she's ever treated. Apparently, usually after a traumatic event, the patient wants to talk about it every week, and every week she guides them to reframe the event to alter the memory; the facts stay the same, but the emotions become less harmful and more empowering. She described it as a normalizing process. Except, apparently the weird thing about me is, I don't volunteer emotional details; despite the amount of time it took to explain everything, my explanations remained factual; sometimes she'd ask about emotions and I'd answer quickly, but it seemed mostly irrelevant. She said that from what she's seeing and hearing, it seems like I don't have strong emotional ties to the facts; I can analyze my reactions, analyze what happened, I'm good at explaining what I feel if asked... but when I remember an event, emotions seem hardly relevant. Because of this she's not quite sure how to proceed, because she's not sure her usual mode of treatment would actually make any difference for me. She doesn't know whether it's an Aspie thing, or just a me thing.

Overall, I'm just curious; for those here who see a psychologist, counselor, etc, do you naturally incorporate emotions into your stories, or do you need to be prompted to give such information?

She obviously is not experienced with Aspergers, and nothing more.

 

[Tarragon]

I had therapy for a few years prior to me finding out I am an aspie. Whenever I was asked the question of "how do you feel" I couldn't answer! Not a word would come out of my mouth! It probably remains the single best way to shut me up in a conversation!!!!!

I think this must be an aspie thing. Sounds like it with the responses to the thread so far. memory and emotional response are two different things. I'm sure we do have emotions and our memories and past events do affect us, its just we seem to lack the wiring pathways which make it easy for us to see what emotions are triggered by these events, and how they affect us.

When I say lack, I of course mean we are wired up differently(!). Whether we can work out what's going on or not is up to the (so called) professionals!! I did "group therapy" which was a completely waste of time for me. I did some cbt, which was much more promising except that the guy doing it told me he had no experience of aspergers, so the cbt was based on nt thinking. I found it theoretically interesting, but it didn't really connect with me (you guessed it!) emotionally!!

I would quiz your doctor about aspergers because while any therapy is better than none, therapy for an aspie with someone not experienced in this sounds to me like a wasted opportunity.

 

[LittleFiddle05]

She obviously is not experienced with Aspergers, and nothing more.

Actually, prior to a therapy setting, her employment was specifically doing Asperger's diagnoses. She's done a lot of work putting together resources for people with Asperger's, as well, apparently.. so she's certainly not unfamiliar with the diagnosis, though perhaps she's unfamiliar with therapy for aspies...

 

[LittleFiddle05]

I had therapy for a few years prior to me finding out I am an aspie. Whenever I was asked the question of "how do you feel" I couldn't answer! Not a word would come out of my mouth! It probably remains the single best way to shut me up in a conversation!!!!!
ding
I think this must be an aspie thing. Sounds like it with the responses to the thread so far. memory and emotional response are two different things. I'm sure we do have emotions and our memories and past events do affect us, its just we seem to lack the wiring pathways which make it easy for us to see what emotions are triggered by these events, and how they affect us.

When I say lack, I of course mean we are wired up differently(!). Whether we can work out what's going on or not is up to the (so called) professionals!! I did "group therapy" which was a completely waste of time for me. I did some cbt, which was much more promising except that the guy doing it told me he had no experience of aspergers, so the cbt was based on nt thinking. I found it theoretically interesting, but it didn't really connect with me (you guessed it!) emotionally!!

I would quiz your doctor about aspergers because while any therapy is better than none, therapy for an aspie with someone not experienced in this sounds to me like a wasted opportunity.

Good to know I'm not the only one! It's funny, I'm very articulate when it comes to emotions - I've spent enough time alone that I've learned to overanalyze myself to make up for the lack of company. It's like I have the full understanding, but don't instinctively see the relevance. I didn't even realize I was omitting emotions until she pointed it out, I felt like I was telling everything!

 

[Daniel]

Very interesting... I've been in therapy for the past year, and knew I was an Aspie before that. I had to really think about this because I hadn't thought about this before, and I feel like the insights here apply to me.

I either talk about memories or I talk about feelings. When I talk about my emotions, it's in an analytical way, where I describe how my feelings seem to work. When I talk about memories, it's straight-up reportage. I don't get emotional when I remember events. I don't relive the emotions if I think about a past trauma. I've never felt the need to not talk about something because it brought up unpleasant emotions.

Apparently, usually after a traumatic event, the patient wants to talk about it every week, and every week she guides them to reframe the event to alter the memory; the facts stay the same, but the emotions become less harmful and more empowering. She described it as a normalizing process.

It's funny to me now... With probably the single most traumatizing thing that happened to me (won't go into details for once in my life), I had to reframe the event to discover that there actually was an emotional impact that lingered. I had to denormalize it to uncover the trauma. And I did that on my own, and not in therapy. I then reported my emotional work to my therapist in my next session.

Come to think of it--I guess I use my therapy sessions as information-reporting and perspective-gathering workshops, and the emotional growth, the therapeutic work, happens when I'm on my own.

 

[Dark]

Might be a relevant co-morbidity for this thread: Alexithymia

I'm not entirely sure how I deal with emotions. I certainly don't like discussing them with people (my therapist included), but I'm very uncomfortable with vulnerability, so I imagine that's likely why. When I do include emotions in my stories, I usually recount them as states of fact rather than personal experiences (e.g., "it was an upsetting event" as opposed to "the event made me upset") unless I'm directly asked how I feel.

I definitely relate to Daniel's comment about therapy being a "workshop," though. I'd rather just get practical tools for framing and overcoming my challenges rather than having a two-hour chin-wag about my feelings. I can sort those out on my own.

 

[dragonwolf]

Actually, prior to a therapy setting, her employment was specifically doing Asperger's diagnoses. She's done a lot of work putting together resources for people with Asperger's, as well, apparently.. so she's certainly not unfamiliar with the diagnosis, though perhaps she's unfamiliar with therapy for aspies...

I think diagnosing Asperger's and treating Asperger's are two different things. I'd be interested in seeing the resources she puts together. Given the information in this thread, I'd surmise that said resources would be a lot more NT-oriented. "Reporting" events pretty much sans emotion is pretty characteristic of Asperger's/Autism. After all, it's a common misconception that we lack things like feelings/emotions, empathy, theory of mind, etc. That misconception has to come from somewhere, so it shouldn't be a surprise to see a disconnect between the memory and the emotion when its described to her.

 

[Cerulean]

When I was a child, a small boy was killed by a car in my neighborhood in Chicago. I watched firemen put him into a body bag. I can play the movie in my head but there are no emotions, just pictures with some rather grisly details. I never told my family what I saw. I did not feel the need to tell anyone.

I seem to have a similar lack of response to death in real life. My parents keep telling me when people die, relatives or our neighbor we lived next to for 20+ years. And my mental response is to the effect of "oh well". I struggle to attempt to appear like I care or have an emotional response because people don't like the "oh well" response.
However for some reason I can be very upset when fictional characters die.

 

[Andy R]

I struggle with 'How did that make you feel?'. My Counsellor asked me a couple of weeks ago and I gave him a long, detailed analysis of what I was thinking and why. He said my reply was 2 steps above the question he was actually asking me. I was unable to remove those steps and tell him my feelings.

 

[Effy]

She obviously is not experienced with Aspergers, and nothing more.

This.

My therapist is experienced just slightly with autism, and she is learning more as she goes to better help her patients, and it makes a huge difference when the person helping you has experience, because they know and understand that therapy with you is going to be different.

Mine knows to prompt me when I say I'm "okay", "fine", "good", etc., or that anything is such, because my emotions toward things are so different. It just makes a big difference, and if you had someone who was more knowledgeable to your diagnosis, you most likely wouldn't have been told that.

Personally, emotions surrounding something are completely redundant - why does how I feel matter? Then again, if it hurts me greatly, then those feelings do matter. How much I have suppressed those feelings plays a large part in the relevancy of emotions. Talking about feelings is something I try to avoid, but whether that stems from childhood or Aspie stuff is unknown.

 

[Peace]

It seems to be common for us (Aspies) ty separate our emotions from everything else. We commonly act on logic without attaching emotion to it, as emotion does nothing for problem solving. I have been seen by several different "Professionals" who have all agreed on this.
Just my experience.

 

[KassieMac]

Actually, prior to a therapy setting, her employment was specifically doing Asperger's diagnoses. She's done a lot of work putting together resources for people with Asperger's, as well, apparently.. so she's certainly not unfamiliar with the diagnosis, though perhaps she's unfamiliar with therapy for aspies...

I think diagnosing Asperger's and treating Asperger's are two different things. I'd be interested in seeing the resources she puts together. Given the information in this thread, I'd surmise that said resources would be a lot more NT-oriented. "Reporting" events pretty much sans emotion is pretty characteristic of Asperger's/Autism. After all, it's a common misconception that we lack things like feelings/emotions, empathy, theory of mind, etc. That misconception has to come from somewhere, so it shouldn't be a surprise to see a disconnect between the memory and the emotion when its described to her.

I've thought about this quite a bit, and I think I've come to a conclusion ... I'd love to know what you guys all think about this.

It's the difference between those who talk about us and those who talk (and listen) to us. Those who talk about us may see, but if they never take the step to observe ... or the further steps to interact and understand ... then it doesn't matter how many years of 'experience' they have, they won't be much help. I've been seeing this therapist for just over six years, and for most of that she tried to force her conventional therapy methods on me ... but I never felt any better. When I recently mentioned Aspergers again, she claimed to have experience based on her son's girlfriend ... wait, what?? She never truly observed until I finally asserted myself. I'm convinced that if I hadn't, we could've continued therapy until the end of time but she would never truly have experience with Aspergers.

Does this make any sense at all?

 

[Jerome]

So, last week my psychologist said something that really got me thinking, and I'm curious to hear what others have experienced.

I've had a few traumatizing experiences this year (most notably, finding my roommate after she committed suicide). It took weeks to tell my psychologist everything, but I finally did; after finishing, she listed 6 things that she thinks we'll need to address; I asked "Okay, how do we address them?" Two weeks later, she brought up that conversation and said it had really thrown her off; she said that I respond to therapy differently than anyone else she's ever treated. Apparently, usually after a traumatic event, the patient wants to talk about it every week, and every week she guides them to reframe the event to alter the memory; the facts stay the same, but the emotions become less harmful and more empowering. She described it as a normalizing process. Except, apparently the weird thing about me is, I don't volunteer emotional details; despite the amount of time it took to explain everything, my explanations remained factual; sometimes she'd ask about emotions and I'd answer quickly, but it seemed mostly irrelevant. She said that from what she's seeing and hearing, it seems like I don't have strong emotional ties to the facts; I can analyze my reactions, analyze what happened, I'm good at explaining what I feel if asked... but when I remember an event, emotions seem hardly relevant. Because of this she's not quite sure how to proceed, because she's not sure her usual mode of treatment would actually make any difference for me. She doesn't know whether it's an Aspie thing, or just a me thing.

Overall, I'm just curious; for those here who see a psychologist, counselor, etc, do you naturally incorporate emotions into your stories, or do you need to be prompted to give such information?

So, last week my psychologist said something that really got me thinking, and I'm curious to hear what others have experienced.

I've had a few traumatizing experiences this year (most notably, finding my roommate after she committed suicide). It took weeks to tell my psychologist everything, but I finally did; after finishing, she listed 6 things that she thinks we'll need to address; I asked "Okay, how do we address them?" Two weeks later, she brought up that conversation and said it had really thrown her off; she said that I respond to therapy differently than anyone else she's ever treated. Apparently, usually after a traumatic event, the patient wants to talk about it every week, and every week she guides them to reframe the event to alter the memory; the facts stay the same, but the emotions become less harmful and more empowering. She described it as a normalizing process. Except, apparently the weird thing about me is, I don't volunteer emotional details; despite the amount of time it took to explain everything, my explanations remained factual; sometimes she'd ask about emotions and I'd answer quickly, but it seemed mostly irrelevant. She said that from what she's seeing and hearing, it seems like I don't have strong emotional ties to the facts; I can analyze my reactions, analyze what happened, I'm good at explaining what I feel if asked... but when I remember an event, emotions seem hardly relevant. Because of this she's not quite sure how to proceed, because she's not sure her usual mode of treatment would actually make any difference for me. She doesn't know whether it's an Aspie thing, or just a me thing.

Overall, I'm just curious; for those here who see a psychologist, counselor, etc, do you naturally incorporate emotions into your stories, or do you need to be prompted to give such information?

I am in Alcoholics Anonymous and when I first did my 5th Step, which is a confession of sorts. My sponsor, the person I shared my confession with, noted how emotionally detached I was from some of the most horrific events in my life. This prompted him to continue to probe (my words) into my psyche by having me do more inventory (The 4th Step) and more confession. He even suggested I pray and ask God to help me cry. Eventually, I did get emotional attachment to my own life story and the tears started to flow. This was 22 years ago. Only in the last two years have I become aware of my AS. Today, my emotions still seem to elude me or come very strongly, and this creates a great deal of anxiety that wipes me out. AS has been a blessing and a curse. It has afforded me a deep insight into the process of recovery from drugs and alcohol that has benefitted many people in recovery. I remember the day I cut ties with my emotions and became a Vulcan (LOL). I adopted Spock from Star Trek as a role model because I understood him better than I understood humans. One of his famous lines from the Star Trek movie franchise was "The needs of the many outweighed the needs of the few, or the one." He sacrificed himself to save the crew. Funny how that turned into a self-fulfilling prophecy for me. However, today,the needs of the one outweigh the needs of the many. I just called my employerks EAP service and asked for help with AS. I have a list of providers to choose from. I am male, but specifically asked for a female provider because I think their nurturin nature would lend more towards emotional development. I could be wrong, but hey, its my dime. Ikve had therapy before, but never for AS. This should be an interesting adventure. Thanks for sharing your experience. It was very helpful to me.

 

[Dark]

I've thought about this quite a bit, and I think I've come to a conclusion ... I'd love to know what you guys all think about this.

It's the difference between those who talk about us and those who talk (and listen) to us. Those who talk about us may see, but if they never take the step to observe ... or the further steps to interact and understand ... then it doesn't matter how many years of 'experience' they have, they won't be much help. I've been seeing this therapist for just over six years, and for most of that she tried to force her conventional therapy methods on me ... but I never felt any better. When I recently mentioned Aspergers again, she claimed to have experience based on her son's girlfriend ... wait, what?? She never truly observed until I finally asserted myself. I'm convinced that if I hadn't, we could've continued therapy until the end of time but she would never truly have experience with Aspergers.

Does this make any sense at all?

And therein lies the rub. People assume they know what it's like to be us simply because they've observed us in some capacity or another. You don't get to know a person by reading facts and making assumptions, you get to know a person by asking and listening, and letting them tell you about their experiences.

 

[KassieMac]

And therein lies the rub. People assume they know what it's like to be us simply because they've observed us in some capacity or another. You don't get to know a person by reading facts and making assumptions, you get to know a person by asking and listening, and letting them tell you about their experiences.

Exactly. The so-called 'professionals' will never gain any level of understanding if they only talk to/listen to/believe each other. I used my Helen Keller analogy with my therapist this week … she had no response.

 

[friday13th]

I have the same experience in therapy. I don't know how to talk about feelings because they aren't 'facts' to me the way other things are.
My therapist also told me that I'm "an enigma" and she's never treated someone like me before. Yay.
Whenever she asks an open-ended question, I get frustrated. That must be frustrating for her. She'll say something like "how does that make you feel?" and I always tell her - I don't know how to answer questions like that. It's just too... vague or something. I've definitely been told that getting information out of me is like pulling teeth. I've heard that so many times throughout my entire life. I wish I wasn't like this.

 

[KassieMac]

I find most others to be just as baffling. When I ask questions … to seek knowledge, to make informed decisions, or when providing tech support (I'm not referring to casual conversation here) … I'm very careful to word my questions very specifically to make it as clear as possible what I need to know. No matter how clear or specific I am, I rarely get a direct answer. People start chattering before I even finish the question (arrogant assumption that they know what I'm about to ask), or they answer the question they think I should've asked (thinly veiled attempt to 'correct' me & set me on their presumably better path … again, arrogance), or they chatter about something completely unrelated (fear that if they answer me they'll get 'in trouble' is my best guess).

The questions I'm referring to are like "Would you please read to me exactly what's on your screen?" … but they either can't, or won't. Talking to them is like pulling teeth … even when they call me for help, they still refuse to cooperate.

I'd much rather be like us, able to see the world clearly & objectively and able to use language for communication (as it is intended), then be so crippled by denial, fear, arrogance, doubt, etc that I can't communicate clearly.

 

[dragonwolf]

I find most others to be just as baffling. When I ask questions … to seek knowledge, to make informed decisions, or when providing tech support (I'm not referring to casual conversation here) … I'm very careful to word my questions very specifically to make it as clear as possible what I need to know. No matter how clear or specific I am, I rarely get a direct answer. People start chattering before I even finish the question (arrogant assumption that they know what I'm about to ask), or they answer the question they think I should've asked (thinly veiled attempt to 'correct' me & set me on their presumably better path … again, arrogance), or they chatter about something completely unrelated (fear that if they answer me they'll get 'in trouble' is my best guess).

The questions I'm referring to are like "Would you please read to me exactly what's on your screen?" … but they either can't, or won't. Talking to them is like pulling teeth … even when they call me for help, they still refuse to cooperate.

I'd much rather be like us, able to see the world clearly & objectively and able to use language for communication (as it is intended), then be so crippled by denial, fear, arrogance, doubt, etc that I can't communicate clearly.

My husband and I did retail tech support and computer sales for a time. Almost invariably, we'd get people who would tell us about all the mysterious popups they were getting. We'd completely bypass the questioning and go straight to "stop going to shady porn sites." Ooh, the looks we'd get from people! It was priceless! You'd swear they'd start raging about us reading their minds or spying on them or something! (No, it's just that porn is taboo, so it's one of the big reasons people hem and haw around when talking about popups on a computer.)

I think the only thing that trumped that was when the wife/mother was there and being the assertive one. She'd get so red-faced at her husband and/or son, and get so speechlessly flustered!