"Are autistic people at a greater risk of being radicalised?"

[DuckRabbit]

Has anyone seen this yet?:
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Are autistic people at a greater risk of being radicalised? Those with the condition could be more likely to become 'lone wolf' terrorists

• 
  
• People with Autism Spectrum Disorder may be vulnerable to ISIS propaganda
  
• Autistic people are more isolated and lonely and so may be easier to target
  
• Their obsessive and compulsive tendencies could also put them at a higher risk
  
• Findings suggest people involved with terrorism should be evaluated for ASD

By Clare Allely For The Conversation

PUBLISHED: 17:05, 23 June 2017 | UPDATED: 17:05, 23 June 2017

Read more: Autistic people could be at risk of being radicalised | Daily Mail Online

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It seems there is no end to the negative projections onto ASD individuals. I would have thought that, with their independent thinking and general lack of susceptibility to mass movements, advertising, marketing and propaganda, ASD individuals would be the very last in society to be radicalised!

Look how readily the link is made between 'not having many friends' (note how this is framed cf. not "enjoying one's own company") and violent psychopathology:

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Lastly, they identify suicide bombers who are willing to give their lives. Lone wolf terrorism would fit this last category.

Reilly did not have many friends and lived in a poor area of Plymouth, England.
Reilly clearly had difficulties relating to other people and had a fixation with terrorism and martyrdom
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The article also states:

"It is important to caution here that there is no substantial link between ASD and terrorism.
However, there may be specific risk factors which could increase the risk of offending among people with ASD.
Autistic special interests such as fantasy, obsessiveness (extreme compulsiveness), the need for routine/predictability and social/communication difficulties can all increase the vulnerability of an person with ASD to going down the pathway to terrorism."

An ASD individual is as likely as a NT individual to be left-wing or right-wing in their politics, theist or atheist in their religion, psychopathic or non-psychopathic, bullying and abusive or kind and empathetic in their human relationships. Why does this research not examine equally the "specific risk factors", including "the need to matter", which could "increase the risk of offending among people with neurotypicality"?

By this logic, ASD individuals would be more likely to join gangs. But surely it is more likely to be NTs for whom 'belonging to the group' and 'social status within the group' matter?

"They also have a tendency to hyper-focus in on their fascinations and interests at the expense of other attachments and life interests."
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Even though they admit "there is no substantial link between ASD and terrorism", my assessment is that this is biased research starting from flawed premises. Way to reduce prejudice against and hostility towards neurodiverse groups in society...

 

[Judge]

"Findings suggest people involved with terrorism should be evaluated for ASD". Some folks in academia need to put their thinking caps back on.

ROTFLMAO. If populists running various governments are bent on reducing the cost of aid to those autistic citizens who need help, I doubt they're going to be in the mood to provide a professional diagnosis to terrorists.

CIA Interrogator: "Ok, Hamid. We're done with the water-boarding for today. Now off with you to the shrink. We need to know if you're on the spectrum of autism."

Hamid: "Cool! Would a positive diagnosis keep me out of Guantanamo?"

CIA Interrogator: "Hellno."

Hamid: "Oh well, I had to ask."

 

[MonolithImmortal]

What a load of crap. I don't expect anything less from the Daily Fail. Never-mind that people on the spectrum are less likely to be religious, we're less likely to be sucked into the kind of brainwashing cults that religious terror requires. Of course we're not immune, but this is ridiculous.

 

[ksheehan88]

Yeah... what a bunch of crap.

 

[MonolithImmortal]

I mean, if you're on the spectrum and you've been severely bullied and abused your whole life then yes I suppose you might be at risk for participating in violence, but it's the lifetime of violence against you that made you at risk, not having ASD. FFS people this isn't rocket science.

 

[DuckRabbit]

What a load of crap. I don't expect anything less from the Daily Fail. Never-mind that people on the spectrum are less likely to be religious, we're less likely to be sucked into the kind of brainwashing cults that religious terror requires. Of course we're not immune, but this is ridiculous.

I take the Daily Mail pretty seriously as it's where the research and views of 'experts' trickle down to the lay population, forming the images, values, ideas, metaphors, beliefs, and practices that are shared among the members of groups and communities. Their headlines and articles help to constitute the stereotypes and prototypes about phenomena and issues that constellate in people's minds when certain key terms and buzz words are seen/heard e.g., "autism", "terror", "radicalisation". Words, images and ideas that co-occur in the media, including (especially?) in tabloid newspapers, are likely to be stored together neurologically, in people's brains and minds. By definition, the distillation process from research papers to social media means that the images and ideas invariably occur in some biased form - selecting some aspects and neglecting or omitting others. In this case however it sounds like the primary search was biased - but it's the DM's reporting of it, I believe, that will have the biggest shaping effect in people's minds. This is how we are all largely *aware of* what the stereotypes are of certain phenomena, even if we don't personally subscribe to those stereotypes. However, any sort of cognitive overload or over-stimulation, including tiredness, makes it harder to resist that knowledge of the stereotype.

 

[toothless]

there is only ONE person i can think of who has knowingly acted as a lone wolf terrorist, he is a UK aspie who had converted to radicalised islam,he made a bomb and tried to blow up a mcdonalds if i remember correctly but he just ended up hurting himself-his own hands and he got done for it.
you see, there is no other modern day autist that we know of who is doing lone wolf terrorism on us,theres millions of us in the world yet compared to how many NT lone wolf terrorists there have been? seriously the difference is massive,im not just talking about radicalised islam,what about people who supported the IRA before the peace treaty?

im fed up at us being made out to be terrorists or pyschopaths,get your stories right you bunch of useless hacks,they must have a clue how damaging they are to us.

 

[Mia]

Think individuals with autism as a rule are rational, more so than others. They may not have experience with manipulative people, yet seem more intelligent than most others a good portion of the time. Don't perceive them as individuals who would become involved whole-hardheadedly in radicalization. Given time to consider it, they would quite likely not do something outside their comfort zone. That is going somewhere and having to use noisy weaponry or leaving their room or home for another country. Aspies in general don't do well with radical changes of any sort.

Most people that I know of who have become involved in something akin to a cult or a 'new way' did so after some sort of loss. Job, boyfriend, girlfriend, home, death of a parent. When they were at their weakest psychologically, the brainwashing stuck. Several were in their twenties and searching aimlessely for something to grasp and give their lives meaning. Two people that I used to know became involved separately in different cults, which they eventually left after about five years. Both were 'looking' and searching around for something or anything that would give their lives meaning. Think that they would more likely be the kind of individual who would become radicalized.

 

[Abe1]

Typical daily Mail BS.

Perhaps they should say people who gutter trash papers like the mail are more likely to be radicalised.

 

[DuckRabbit]

Think individuals with autism as a rule are rational, more so than others. They may not have experience with manipulative people, yet seem more intelligent than most others a good portion of the time. Don't perceive them as individuals who would become involved whole-hardheadedly in radicalization. Given time to consider it, they would quite likely not do something outside their comfort zone. That is going somewhere and having to use noisy weaponry or leaving their room or home for another country. Aspies in general don't do well with radical changes of any sort.

Most people that I know of who have become involved in something akin to a cult or a 'new way' did so after some sort of loss. Job, boyfriend, girlfriend, home, death of a parent. When they were at their weakest psychologically, the brainwashing stuck. Several were in their twenties and searching aimlessely for something to grasp and give their lives meaning. Two people that I used to know became involved separately in different cults, which they eventually left after about five years. Both were 'looking' and searching around for something or anything that would give their lives meaning. Think that they would more likely be the kind of individual who would become radicalized.

You identify some very persuasive reasons why ASD individuals are less unlikely to be radicalised.

The topic of who joins cults and who avoids them is fascinating. I think there is definitely some sort of lack of ego-strength in the people who join them. They are unable to be individualistic and self-directed. They prefer to be told 'which way is up' (something no one knows; I believe this has to be figured out individually) and they don't want to bother with questioning anything (phew, so much easier than assuming moral responsibility for oneself!).

Also, people who join ISIS often have violent impulses. They then seek out situations in which these base impulses can be not only safely expressed but also expressed with group approval ('a club for psychopaths'). Some people don't want the burden of self-responsibility; they would rather regress to infancy where their mindless, basest impulses gain approval - or like patients with a psychoanalyst when nothing they say or feel gets censured; anything goes.

When ISIS started killing their own members for defecting, I remember a laconic online comment that made me smile: "The first thing ISIS has done that I agree with".

 

[Danny 74]

Absolute rubbish. Yeah jog on...!

 

[Mia]

The topic of who joins cults and who avoids them is fascinating. I think there is definitely some sort of lack of ego-strength in the people who join them. They are unable to be individualistic and self-directed. They prefer to be told 'which way is up' (something no one knows; I believe this has to be figured out individually) and they don't want to bother with questioning anything (phew, so much easier than assuming moral responsibility for oneself!).

Also, people who join ISIS often have violent impulses. They then seek out situations in which these base impulses can be not only safely expressed but also expressed with group approval ('a club for psychopaths'). Some people don't want the burden of self-responsibility; they would rather regress to infancy where their mindless, basest impulses gain approval - or like patients with a psychoanalyst when nothing they say or feel gets censured; anything goes.

Have often wondered why a friend who joined a cult did so. It wasn't that he had no 'moral compass', he did, along with a regular middle class life in which any reasonable thing he wanted he could achieve. Several degrees, loving parents, yet off he went, to join a cult. A good portion of his life was given up to this; working for them, marrying within the cult to someone chosen by the leader. Never understood why someone with so much potential and ambition would do such a thing. (Edited for privacy)

Seems as if there are continually people who go and join up for wars in other countries. The spanish civil war and many others for ethical or moral reasons. A misunderstanding of the realities of war; many of the isis fighters from other countries joined with romantic ideals of holy war. Promised wives and freedom from constraint, yet many have defected, too young to really understand the reality. All that they do is unethical in their horror-quest; kidnapping, destroying, bombing, killing, hurting. It accomplishes nothing.

 

[Jet Weiss]

I think this theory is a load of BS.
Unfortunately not the first time I have heard it though, I had a teacher who called me a sociopath and claimed that I didn't feel empathy. The same thing was said about my dad (who was also on the spectrum) by a family member.
Imo there is a difference between having trouble relating to peers and appropriately expressing emotions and not being able to feel empathy.

 

[DuckRabbit]

Have often wondered why a friend who joined a cult did so. It wasn't that she had no 'moral compass', she did, along with a regular middle class life in which any reasonable thing she wanted she could achieve. Several degrees, loving parents, yet off she went to join the Unification church. A good portion of her life was given up to this, working for them, marrying within the church to someone chosen for her. I never understood why someone with so much potential and ambition would do such a thing.

Seems as if there are continually people who go and join up for wars in other countries. The spanish civil war and many others for ethical or moral reasons. A misunderstanding of the realities of war; many of the isis fighters from other countries joined with romantic ideals of holy war. Promised wives and freedom from constraint, yet many have defected, too young to really understand the reality. All that they do is unethical in their horror-quest; kidnapping, destroying, bombing, killing, hurting. It accomplishes nothing.

Yes, a stereotype prevails that only the feeble-minded and the damaged join cults, but in reality the human psyche is more complex than that - why some people need to feel part of a large group or movement or devote their life to some creed ('If I'm following these rules, it indicates I'm a worthy person'). I'm sure some do it to acquire a sense of acceptance and belonging that they haven't found anywhere else in society. I'm sure others do it to fulfil power needs - if they're at the top of the hierarchy, they are seen as an authority and they may enjoy the status, attention and control over supplicants ('I can be someone'). They say leaders and followers are opposite sides of the same coin - both need each other. The problem in cults is the lack of self-reflexiveness about what needs they are fulfilling by being there.

All that they do is unethical in their horror-quest; kidnapping, destroying, bombing, killing, hurting. It accomplishes nothing.

I'm not so sure. Apart from being exciting and stimulating for some minds, it is a way to gain status in the group; it fulfils needs for power and control ('If I can prevail over your death, it means I'm stronger/ more cosmically important/ more worthy to survive than you'). Those who join up to fight wars may have appetites for aggression, hierarchy, power and violence which kidnapping, destroying, bombing, killing, hurting satisfy.

Others who join up to fight wars do so because they think it's morally right ('cleansing the planet of undesirables'). They may be more ideological than cynical about human nature. They are naive; they don't realise that ideologies can sound wonderful on paper but don't translate well when imposed on the human psyche, including their own. On the other hand, those who *didn't* sign up to fight Hitler proved to be the ideological ones with no real understanding of human nature! i.e., the threat he posed - many thought 'he can't be that nasty/unreasonable'!

 

[WildCat]

Junk articles never cease to amuse me. As if people with ASD don't get enough scrutiny as it is, but oh no, somebody has to go and run their mouth again? Way to fuel the fire Daily Mail.

Also, you'd have to be a big enough idiot to join ISIS (or ISIL, IS, whatever the hell it's called these days) in the first place, period. We might lack social intuition, but we're definitely far from idiots unable to learn the ways of this world. I don't think I need to remind anyone that radical anything is a dangerous and difficult position for anyone to be in.

 

[Judge]

There's a cruel reality with much of any extremist cult-like organizations and authoritarian mass movements in general. An incredibly strict demand for social and ideological conformity. Something most anyone on the spectrum of autism is likely to find as intolerable. And then more ominously is the reciprocal of this.

Join ISIS? You think those people would tolerate anyone with our traits and behaviors? Really? If NTs are so prone to object to our being socially different from them, what chance would any of us have being part of an entity that appears intolerant towards just about everything?

It's laughable.

 

[WereBear]

From what I have studied and observed, a person can be vulnerable to cults if they are lonely or depressed or otherwise going through stress, but they don't actually choose to join a cult. They are far more likely to be sucked into it with some solid psychological ploys:

• Lovebombing: designated members pay affectionate and flattering attention to the potential recruit. This also makes the victim feel obligated to return the favor of their new friends. This is the Law of Reciprocity, and so they are likely to agree to attend a gathering of more of these nice folks.
• Hypnotic state: engaging in song, chanting, or other group activities pulls a person into a state of uncritical acceptance and they are less likely to evaluate or think too much about what they are being told. When the crowd reacts with happiness and acceptance of the things that are said by a leader, this can pull a person along with social conformity cues.
• Investment: the more the victim accepts the friendships, enjoys the attention, and becomes open to wanting this idealized life that is dangled before them, the more willing they are to return "favors" such as attending more and longer meetings and performing tasks for the group.
• Commitment: the victim is supported and encouraged in their enthusiasm as this all seems to be "working." They have an entire group with a system that makes them so happy and confident and want the victim's dreams to come true! They will sign something, or invest something, or give up something at this point; all to make them feel discouraged from withdrawal as the cult asks more and more of them.
• Entrapment: the victim gets more enmeshed, drops other aspects of their life as not really worth hanging onto now that this new pathway has opened to them, and are "tested" by undergoing unpleasant tasks or requests. Much like the way hazing in fraternities just makes the potential recruit more determined to join and make all the suffering worthwhile.

By the time the victim realizes they are getting into trouble, they usually have lost their job/living situation/previous social ties, making it difficult to back out. They have agreed to so many things it seems "wrong" to not follow through, and the cult keeps them so busy and miserable they literally cannot think anymore.

It's like a domestic abuse situation; things get really bad, but before the person makes solid moves to leave, things get briefly nice again. The victim has hope that the lovely dream will still come true. They dig themselves in deeper.

As we can see, there are many places here where a person with autism is less likely to get pulled into this than an NT. While we might have social struggles or feel lonely, we actually cope better with such challenges and enjoy our solitary times. We aren't that attracted to group activities, and have a lot more resistance to social pressure and conformity. Far from having no empathy, a lot of us have tons and tons of it, as our kindness to people and animals shows. And even if we do have troubled feelings, we don't seem to turn it outward and blame others. We are more likely to avoid bullying than we are to become bullies.

This whole article was pulled out of an area not known for thinking.

 

[Calibar]

Would not surprise me at all if autistics have a higher number of lone wolves proportionally speaking (especially reading some about some of their personality traits over the years in newspapers). Ultimately these claims will need to be judged by how good the method they were inferred from was rather than whether we personally like it or not.

 

[Blast off]

All I have to say about this subject is ROFL... I hope this news site is satire like "The Onion".. If not way to alienate people already extremely alienated.. The only thing different from myself and most NTs is the capacity to be able to think rather than jumping to conclusions constantly. Bunch of crap created to stir people up.

 

[Aeolienne]

There is only ONE person I can think of who has knowingly acted as a lone wolf terrorist, he is a UK Aspie who had converted to radicalised Islam, he made a bomb and tried to blow up a McDonalds if I remember correctly but he just ended up hurting himself - his own hands and he got done for it.

That was Nicky Reilly at the Giraffe Cafe in Exeter. The Mail article in the original post mentions him by name.